OFF: sappy prog

[Henderson Keith]

didn't mean to spur on such an off-topic debate, but...

DK counters my answer with...

>>No, I don't think iQ is dark.  They're "fake" dark, maybe.  I find them
very
>>warm, in fact.  Dreamy textures, the types of keyboards, the production?
I
>>don't know what it is, but something takes true 'darkness' out of my mind
>>when listening to them.

>I disagree.  :-)

OK, please return your mispressed CD to the store where you purchased it and
ask for a proper copy.  :)

Seriously, this (Dark Matter) is a *very* happy album, full of playful
guitar licks, warm sounds, upbeat melodies, and an overall uplifting spirit.
Most (if not all) neo-prog is like that.  The occasional 90-second "moody"
passage is there just to provide some modicum of 'balance,' otherwise it
would be too sickeningly happy.  There is nothing here remotely unsafe or
challenging in any way.  And I *like* this album, though I admit it's a
guilty pleasure, since I sometimes like to hear simple 'happy' music.

>>Some of the Scandinavian bands are "true" dark IMHO.  Some
>>Anekdoten, Circle, Landberk...those are much darker than iQ I think.

>I agree.  :-)  Also in a totally different genre.

Yeah, one capable of being 'dark' for instance.  :)

>>Same as Marillion in that aspect (though Fugazi was produced vastly
>>differently for some odd reason, and not at all very well IMHO...though
>>in that way it had more edge, which for Marillion maybe wasn't
>>the best thing, as it was thereby a bit 'forced').

>You don't think Script for a Jester's Tear is dark?

Yeah.  Well, 'dark' as opposed to 'light,' sure.  Though I don't think of
this album as an 'example' of dark music.  If I took it song-by-song, I
might say...

Garden Party - dramatic, intense, and playful
Forgotten Sons - dramatic, intense, and angry
Chelsea Monday - dramatic, intense, and dark
He Knows, You Know - dramatic, intense, spam, more intense, baked beans, and
spam
etc.

You get the picture.  Which is...this album is dramatic and intense (!),
primarily.  If one were to put primary adjectives on it.  Dark (?)...well,
sure, but that's not what comes to mind immediately, that one song
notwithstanding.

But anyway, 'neo-prog' for me lies much more in the direction of 'Misplaced
Childhood' when (partly through production) the 'happy' sound was built into
it.  Other than a moody bit in the long suite at the end of Side One, this
is also a very happy album.  And Fish (solo) has continued to be happy most
of the time, with a few notable exceptions.  (I'm remembering "Speaking in
Tongues" right now, and some of the Steve Wilson stuff was a bit darker.)

>I agree Fugazi was the diferent.  It sounds like you're simply talking
about
>production.

No, not really (not only about production, though that's a big part of it.)

>If a song is about death and mostly in a minor key, that's
>pretty dark to me. A lot of IQ songs fit that bill.  :-)

Firstly, I don't care what the songs are about (I rarely even pay attention
to that).  Music is 'dark' to me when that becomes my emotional state when
listening to the music, irregardless of 'key' or theme.  Or vice versa (ie.,
I put it on *because* of my mood).  Hence, if iQ is "dark," then they're
"fake dark" 'cause they have no ability to do anything but lighten my mood.
Which is fine of course.  Adrian Belew's "Lone Rhino" does the same.

<on Marillion, live>
>Well, I'm going to see them in October.  I like the slow and atmospheric
stuff.

Bring your pillow.  It's great at times, of course, but without bursts of
energy every once in awhile, all momentum is lost in a live setting and the
people stray.  The Gathering is doing the same thing these days (sadly), and
they're *totally* losing the audience.   Why their managers, if they go out
and stand out in the audience like they should, don't go back and tell them
to liven up the setlist is beyond me.  Hawkwind and Pink Floyd have never
done this, though both have used copious amounts of atmospheric stuff.
Moderation is the key, as always.

>That was actually a bad gig, but mainly because here in Boston we got
>a very abbreviated setlist because Pete Trewavas
>had just been mugged up in Montreal the night before!

They don't even need him anymore.  Since he doesn't play anything remotely
interesting these days, they could replace him with a bass sequencer.  And I
used to really like his playing!  Marillion has gotten steadily worse each
and every time I've seen them.  I'm inclined to say that Hogarth has
gradually sapped all of the life out of the group over time, but I have no
idea (other than circumstantial evidence) to say whether that's really true
or not.

>>Their live performances have
>>*twice* the energy as their discs, the exact opposite of Marillion,
Marbles
>>vintage.

>I think that's comparing apples and oranges.

Or marbles and tiddlywinks.  I'll go see the tiddlywinks next time.  :)

Grakkl (FFA)