OFF: The Weller/Kilmister controversy

[Ulf Hamr]

Hi Keith, Since I've met you and know you're an intelligent man. I think The Jam were one of the best bands ever. I know they are unknown in the USA. Here are some video links so you can get a taste.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqiMfPe6U7g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qD9rKUwwPUU&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEOIeYjhaY0&mode=related&search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMGQC05_nSE&mode=related&search=

I never liked Style council myself. Just not the same as the Jam. I'm not too familiar with Pauls solo work either. I won't dismiss it though, because the guy is talented. How can a look determine talent? 
 I absolutely love Joy Division, but maybe its just a matter of taste. I don't like Prog, Procal harum etc... Doesn't mean its crap right?
 I won't say its dreck, just because its not for me. Folks like them, so they can't be complete crap right? 
Living in the UK has made my choice in music different than Americans. Just like most Americans aren't HW fans. 
Never cared much for Duran duran though. Oh well if you don't like the Jam, then thats fine too. 
Take care my friend, Stephe
> 
>     >Whatever Paul Wellers faults, dismissing his work out of hand is just crass.
>    
>   I'm not sure I was the one who was supposedly "dismissing" Weller like so, but I should note that I don't believe I can really "dismiss" somebody who I know absolutely nothing about.  I was being serious...I have *never* heard of Paul Weller before.  (Paul Westerberg, sure, but not this guy.)  Apparently, he's about as famous in the US as cricket commentator (and Turkish historian) E.W. Swanton.  If what I've read in Wikipedia is accurate.
>    
>   His other band, The Style Council, is a vaguely familiar name, but I'm certain I've never heard any of their music either.  The Jam is 100% obscure to me.  Most semi-popular bands I have at least come to recognize by name simply by spending half my life in record/CD stores over the years.  (That will change in 5 years, when such stores cease to exist...but for now...)
>    
>   But anyway, from his look alone in the photo accompanying the article, it appeared to me he was some sort of new-waver guy.  The Jam, though, seems to have started out in 1977 or thereabouts, which means that he predates New Wave by a few years, so I can't guess exactly what they sounded like.  "Mod revivalist" or whatever they're called doesn't mean much to me, because I didn't even know there was any revival of "mod" culture, which itself was pretty much a British thing to start with.  (I remember watching Quadrophenia in college and thinking this is all made up...there were never actual subcultures like this, were there?)  Anyway, I get the impression even that Jam stuff might be fairly awful, if it were a throwback to early/mid 60s.  Music starts to get interesting for me about 1967, *not* 1966 (OK, Tomorrow Never Knows, *maybe*), but *certainly* not 1965.  There's a very sharp line, maybe June 21, 1967 or something. Until Pink Floyd, or Procol Harum's 1st, or Days of
>  Future Passed,  I'm simply not interested when it comes to popular forms of music.  Period.
>    
>   > Who the f*ck is Paul Weller? Never heard of him...or this band "the Jam."
> 
>   So, again, who the f*ck is he?  Really?!  :)
>    
>   I mean, nobody has really talked substantively about his music, either with these two old bands or solo work.  I hate to clutter up the list with such terrible off-topic nonsense, but I'm really quite amazed that somebody so (apparently) famous and "influential" could still be a complete unknown to me.  I have, after all, spent quite a lot of time in England myself over the past five years.  And I know who E.W. Swanton was.  :)
>    
>   Grakkl
>    
>   P.S.  Just so it's clear, "80s new wave rubbish" is unnecessarily redundant, as there is no other kind of new wave.  Somebody mentioned Joy Division as a point of reference for this discussion...about five years ago (?), I actually bought a compilation CD of this band (cheapie used, thankfully), based on some recommendations I had seen someplace (not here, I don't think...but who knows?).  Anyway, I found it to be appallingly awful miserable dreck.  The only worse ("rock") bands I have ever heard than Joy Division are Duran Duran and this German band from the same era called "Spliff," oddly enough.  A compilation "Spliff" CD is, almost certainly, the very worst "rock" album I own on CD...  well, FM's "Tonight" might also come close, although I might have lost that one (hopefully) somewhere along the line.  I don't think I've ever managed to listen to any of these all the way through.  God, 80s music was awful, wasn't it?  I mean, the percussion sound of 80s engineering
>  alone was bad enough to ruin one's day (even infiltrating the halls of one Rockfield Studios in Monmouth, Wales, much to the chagrin of this HW fan), let alone all the nasty keyboards and sappy vocals.  Ugh.  I'm not a Nirvana fan by any stretch of the imagination, but Thank God for Kurt Cobain!!  Post-1989, we've never heard that sort of awful production ever again.  For that alone, he's a saint.
>    
>   P.P.S.  So, is The Jam/Paul Weller "80s" dreck, or not?  1977 is not the worst year to have been "born"...so it could go either way.  I'm a fan of the Police and Talking Heads, after all.
>    
>   P.P.P.S.  Sunn O))) is realllly bad, too.  Why does anybody like this nonsense?  When are they going to stop tuning their guitars, warming up their amplifiers, and play some actual f*cking music?
> 
>  
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